Carla's Blog Posting #2

Second blog posting by Carla Rolfe:

Cults and The Internet

Yesterday, I received a very long comment (broken up in several posts) by a man named Victor Hafichuk. This came as a result of my blog response to an email I received a couple of weeks ago. Since I’ve received several concerned emails and IMs wondering about this whole strange deal, I’m going to post the entirety of that email. Apparently, I’m not the only one who has heard from these folks. You’ll find more on that here, here, and here. One person commenting here said this:

“His normal process in Southern Alberta is to sneek into churches, steal their membership directories and then send out letters to the congregation telling them everything that was wrong with the message and other targeted attacks on leadership in the local church. Yup, saw that first hand and was on the list of targets - thank goodness my wife intercepted the letter and never did read it. Others in the church laughed and threw it away in the garbage.”

Now, I have no way to verify if this is true or not, but it certainly wouldn’t surprise me. I know of a seriously obnoxious hyper-Calvinist that has done things quite similar. I have received many of his wacky emails, along with an open list of all the other email addresses he’s collected over the years.

Here is the actual email (which I thought I had deleted just yesterday, prior to receiving the blog comment, but was still in the trash folder):

The following paper will be of interest and pertinence to you for possibly several reasons among many. It has been our great honor to discern and identify the error and spirit of John Calvin, whose rule is yet propagated in the hearts of men with evil consequences for all. The Lord Jesus Christ has visited us with the Light of His countenance to put an end to this evil, justifying His servants whom Calvin murdered, and His Name in the sight of all.

The Fruit of Cain Multiplied: The Murderer John Calvin

Show me whom you follow, and I will know what manner of person you are or will become. If you do not know whom you are following, don’t you think it is time to find out how and where you are being led? Do you think you will altogether escape the consequences because ignorant? Think again. You already suffer them.

John Calvin was one of the most vicious of wolves ever to pose as a lamb of God. His supremely self-righteous spirit lives on in those who lionize and follow him, even unbeknownst to themselves. Truly, “that which is highly esteemed among men is abomination in the sight of God.”

Paul Cohen & Victor Hafichuk
www.thepathoftruth.com

Back in 1997, my husband and I met some folks just like this, through Prodigy’s online Christian chat rooms. This was a group of “no one is saved except us!” folks who had rejected any association with a local church or recognized denomination. They had all moved to a large piece of property and began an agricultural-Christian-commune. Trolling for converts, they took to the internet and made quite a lot of noise about themselves. There were two main leaders of this cult, and they liked to play the good cop/bad cop routine. One was blantantly obnoxious and insulting, preaching hell and damnation to anyone who didn’t agree with him, and the other was a kinder, gentler version of a cult leader, and actually a quite likable guy - other than the fact that he was just as deceived as his bad cop co-leader. Sadly, one of the regular chatters in that chat room actually went to visit these folks and ended up moving there to live among them. I’m not sure if anyone ever heard from her again, and not long after we dropped the Prodigy service.

I have opted to leave the comments here by Victor Hafichuk, for a couple of reasons. I want my readers to see what routinely shows up in my email inbox. I get letters very similar to this on a regular basis, and have for many years. Most of the time they go right into the spam/junk folder but every once in a while one sneaks through into my inbox. I’m pretty sure that if it weren’t for the internet, I would never really be exposed to things like this. Due to my status as a stay at home mom, I can’t imagine any type of scenario in day to day life where I’d run into people like this, and have their beliefs exposed like you’ll find online.

I want my readers here to know folks like this are out there, so that you can pray for them. Clearly they are deceived, and clearly they need God’s mercy and grace just as much as anyone else does. In my initial blog response I was somewhat sarcastic about all this, but the sarcasm wasn’t aimed at them personally. The big problem with being deceived, is that you don’t know that you are, and there is just NO talking to people like this. The only thing they want to hear, is “you are right, I am wrong, please tell me oh faithful one, how I can make things right!?” They always use the same fiery, insulting, condemning, screechy sort of attack, as if there is a template out there just ready for you to download and insert your own cult’s messages into. I’ve seen this so many times.

It seems for whatever reason, in the last couple of weeks that this group has been very very busy on Christian blog comboxes, displaying the very attitude and conduct I’ve mentioned here.

So I will simply end with the same comment Lee Shelton at The Contemporary Calvinist wrote a few days ago on this same matter:

“I only pray that the Holy Spirit will open their eyes. I pray that they will be convicted of their error and that one day I can welcome them into God’s kingdom as a brothers and sisters in Christ.”

Blog responses:

What is amazing to me is the level of blindness seems to always be trumped by the level of zeal.
Daniel | Homepage | 03.28.08 - 12:35 pm | #

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Wow! Very sad. I’m thankful I’m not on their list and I’m hoping to stay that way.
rebecca | Homepage | 03.28.08 - 4:32 pm | #

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I am so deluded. I really did not think there were people out there like this. It is really quite heart-breaking.
Lisa Nunley | Homepage | 03.29.08 - 9:36 am | #

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Daniel: it used to be amazing to me too, but I’ve seen it so much it no longer has that same affect. It just makes me sad, as Rebecca commented.

Lisa: unfortunately, there are A LOT of people like this “out there” - most of the time however, they don’t go out of their way to draw such attention to themselves. Most of the time (in my experience anyway) they don’t post with real names, real email addresses, or real websites.

Not much you can do with folks like this, beyond prayer. Since they already have all the answers and are absolutely unteachable or unreachable, you’re pretty much left with leaving them, to the Lord.
Carla | Homepage | 03.29.08 - 10:04 am | #

Paul’s reply to Carla:

Carla,

You say there is not much to do with us but to leave us “to the Lord.” You certainly never lifted a finger to do anything for us to begin with, unless you count making fun of what we do and stand for as helpful. Do your readers know, for example, that you never replied to our email to let us know we are supposedly misguided and in the wrong in the first place? Instead you simply dismissed us with open contempt and mockery as entertainment on your blog, ignoring the substance of what we sent you. There is no evidence you have even red the writing in question:

The Fruit of Cain Multiplied: The Murderer John Calvin

What is so loving and godly about your course of action here? Where is the mercy and grace of God demonstrated towards us? You never identified our error to others, much less to us. How are we to be saved from the snares of the devil, if we are so bound, by your making sport of us? I have never seen the Lord or the saints of God use this technique. If we cannot receive any mercy or gracious instruction from you, what is the point of your praying to God that He shows us such? You are just putting on a show for others to appear pious, when you are nothing short of a lying murderer:

“If anyone claims, ‘I love God,’ and hates his brother, he is a liar; for he who does not love his brother whom he has seen, how is it possible for him to love God whom he has not seen?” (1 John 4:20 EMTV)

And:

“Everyone who hates his brother is a murderer, and you know that no murderer has eternal life abiding in him” (1 John 3:15 EMTV).

Since the Lord has given us all the things you mock, it is not really us, but Him that you disdain. You would like to wash your hands of this whole matter, walking away as if justified, but it must and will be noted that you have not answered many pertinent questions that address the pillars on which you build your case against the One we serve.

You reiterate here that you receive mail like ours all the time. Victor had already called you on this matter:

“That is not true. There will not be one letter/paper like ours in spirit and substance that you have received. Prove us wrong, publicly.”

You have not produced anything because you cannot. You are not getting mail like ours and you know it. You are a liar.

You have not answered this charge:

“You say we call others ‘morons.’ You lie, Carla. Find in any of our sites or letters where we say any such thing.”

So where is the evidence, false accuser? Instead of producing the goods you warn everyone that there is no talking to us because we won’t listen. Liar! You won’t talk because you cannot produce the evidence that supports your lies.

Here is a statement you made that Victor asked you to explain, which you have not:

“I don’t get to sit on my high horse and look down my self-righteous nose at him because he’s not saved, or at anyone else because they’re in a different doctrinal place than I am.”

He asked:

“No? What have you just done with us, Carla? What would you call your derision and mockery?”

Why the silence, Carla? We know why. God knows why. Your audience does not know why, but they will find out too. Will you be last to admit the truth? Those who make themselves first, above truthfulness and full disclosure, will be last; you can count on it.

Here is another question you have not answered, except your non-answer is an answer for those with ears to hear:

“Read the accolades you prize: ‘Spot on, Carla ~ spot on,’ and, ‘Excellent and amusing!’ And, ‘Ah, you are marvellous, you know that.’ Joyce, Kristina and Libbie are impressed. Are these the reactions of believers or those of spectators at a sport? Is it Jesus Christ that is glorified? Are these people such that lay down their lives for the Lord or are they as you in all your ways?”

Regarding the actual paper that we described in an introduction sent to you, Victor asked you this very appropriate question:

“Are we wrong to tell you that following a murderer turns you into one? Why would God warn of such things?

‘Blessed is the man who has not walked in the counsel of the ungodly, and has not stood in the way of sinners, and has not sat in the seat of the scornful’ (Psalms 1:1 MKJV).”

Why do you hate, mock and scorn us for saying that men of God do not murder their brethren and boast about it until their dying day? Why do you focus on the messengers rather than on the Message?

Another question about your vaunted grace:

“‘Love always, communal carrot people’? No high horse or looking down the nose here, right, Carla? No, all grace, right?”

What of your grace? You seem to answer this, not speaking to Victor (there is “no talking to” us), but to your audience, saying in this last response that, though you were sarcastic, you did not mean anything personally. What a pile of dung passed off as pudding! If I come up and poke you in the eye, shall you accept my protest that I did not mean it personally? You are a liar, Carla. You act worse than the heathen and then try to pass it off as something acceptable, even commendable. You people had better believe that God hates and is very angry with this kind of behavior.

“Shame on God for being so unChristian,” you say as you stick your noses up in the air, hypocrites! Servetus was certainly correct when he said that trinitarians are atheists. The fools have said in their hearts that there is no God, and they have no fear of Him whatsoever. You will learn to fear Him, though; we promise. That is the salvation of God we preach.

You accused us of not being interested in educating anyone. Victor said:

“No interest in educating anyone? Really? That is quite a judgment throne you have there. Are you not guilty of your own accusations of us? Have you red all that we write and seen what we have done, how we live, the price we pay to do so, and know why we do it? Has God revealed these things to you, Carla?”

Where is your evidence that backs up any of your claims, big-talker? Yes, you are quick to open your mouth, and just as quick to shut it when asked to produce the goods. When you think no one can see, you open it again to accuse, but God sees you and what you do. That is all that matters. When your fair weather friends are gone, where will you be?

Here is another foundational set of questions based on your appeal to God’s grace, none of which you have even attempted to answer:

“You [Carla] write: ‘God’s grace is for all who heed the call to repent, and follow Christ. Even Calvin, and carrot people.’

That is why we preach, and you have not heeded as you claim. If you presume to preach to bring God’s grace to those you think not to have it, is it wrong for us to call people to repentance that they might receive the grace of God, especially when we have it and see that you don’t? Do you not contradict yourself? Your problem is that your definition of grace is ‘iniquity,’ an excuse to do as you please because Christ died for you. It is wickedness. You may think our words to be stout against you and Calvin, but did not the Lord save His harshest words for hypocrites who presumed righteousness and had none?”

Who can argue? Not even the haters of the Lord. As do all heretics and haters of Truth, you find fault first with the messengers rather than the Message. Such is the nature of the beast.

You quote an anonymous poster from another site that condemns Victor, adding, “Now, I have no way to verify if this is true or not....”

That is right, and exactly why such hearsay is inadmissible in any heathen court, let alone among the saints. Why do you present and circulate such reports? It is the nature of the beast.

You bring up some people you met online, whom you claim were a cult. So what? We have nothing to do with them. There is not even guilt by association. So why do you bring it up? It is the nature of the beast.

You quote another blogger who said regarding us:

“I only pray that the Holy Spirit will open their eyes. I pray that they will be convicted of their error and that one day I can welcome them into God’s kingdom as a brothers and sisters in Christ.”

In case you are not up to date on your Calvinist doctrine, it goes like this:

“You really leave me no choice but to predestinate you to eternal torment.”

Why do you try to hide and cover over the horrible things your god has predestined for so many of us, including members of your family and friends? You can just drop this pious sounding, lying, nonsense prayer for those you consider false teachers. These crocodile tears do not fool us and they do not do justice to your false god and doctrine. According to the saying, the crocodiles shed their tears for those the beast would consume. Seeing you cry only confirms what we already see of your vicious spirit and intentions, the very same that Calvin manifested towards Servetus and Castellion.

Yes, the Whore has been drunk with the blood of the saints, but now her day of judgment is here, and who will stop God Who judges her?

Paul Cohen

Victor’s answer to the blog post:

It simply does not matter to Carla Rolfe whether or not she speaks the truth or disseminates unconfirmed, unsubstantiated opinions and criticisms to a nominal Christian public. These things might be true and they might be lies, but to her the important thing is that she maintains her ego and image. Her ways have nothing to do with the Lord Jesus Christ, Who is the Truth, and Who condemns false accusation, demanding that all things be established by two or three witnesses. You are all liars, Nash included, with the same offenses against God that Carla commits. And we will prove it, repeatedly.

Now I will address “Anonymous,” quoted from Nash’s blog, who declares himself, “just a Christian from Canada,” and thus I address all those who support him in his spirit and thinking.

Firstly, he is a coward. Some, like “concerned citizen gal” posting at Rolfe’s blog, claim they have to conceal their identity for the sake of their families. Yet they are not the least reticent to slander others publicly while protecting themselves. How concerned is “concerned citizen gal” about any other family? Is this Christlike conduct? And she accuses me of lacking Christian love?

And then you wonder why God sends spokespersons to “reprove the works of darkness,” especially those that use His Name in their nefarious deeds? Hypocrites!

Anonymous, you and your brood are not as some honest, well-intentioned, genuine brethren of Christ, who reported evil doings of the Corinthians:

“For it has been declared to me concerning you, my brothers, by those of Chloe, that there are contentions among you” (1 Corinthians 1:11 MKJV).

Those of Chloe! They did not mind being named because they knew they were standing in Truth, with the Lord, seeking justice and righteousness, and therefore justified. “Brother Paul, you can tell them we told you so!” They were not hiding in darkness, “Anonymous” and “concerned citizen gal.” Would the apostle Paul condemn anonymously or teach and encourage others to do so?

Manifestly, we are not hiding in darkness because we are children of the Light of the world, the Lord Jesus Christ. How is it that I am a “whack,” speaking boldly and openly, while you are a “Christian,” hiding in the dark, “Anonymous”? Even in her darkness, Carla Rolfe concedes that we do not hide our identity, unlike false critics, as you do. Not that she does it for objectivity’s sake.

Anonymous, I don’t care who you are, but I am ready to meet you face-to-face anywhere and anytime reasonable, with as many friends and supporters as you are willing to bring along. Will that give you some security and encouragement to walk in the light (I speak with tongue in cheek)? We can talk and you, “just a Christian from Canada,” may express specifically your grievances, give us substance, and perhaps an opportunity to correct things I have done wrong and to apologize or compensate, if possible, those I have wronged, ostensibly you.

After all, you say, “Victor and the others that sit at his right and left hand need to make right all the wrongs they have done. Their eternal lives depend on it!” Can I correct something if I don’t know what it is? Does the Lord not counsel His children so? Let’s see:

“But if your brother shall trespass against you, go and tell him his fault between you and him alone. If he hears you, you have gained your brother. But if he will not hear you, take one or two more with you, so that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established. And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell it to the church. But if he neglects to hear the church, let him be to you as a heathen and a tax-collector” (Matthew 18:15-17 MKJV).

I don’t recall you coming to me at all with complaint of wrongdoing. Will you afford me that opportunity, or are you simply satisfied with publicly condemning, accusing others and casting dispersions by mere opinion, with no substance at all? You know who the false accuser is, don’t you, “Christian”? And how does your pastor feel about your conduct, or does he not know what you are doing?

You make several charges but give no facts:

You call me a “whack.” What is that? Are you sure? Is that what God would have you to say of me, “Christian”? Are you a viper, “Anonymous”? They called Jesus a “whack” (“You are mad,” they said) and He called them vipers. Who was justified?

You say you have visited Harvest Haven and that “the place gives you the creeps.”

You confess fear. If Christ is in you, and we are “creepy,” being in the world, and Christ is greater, how do you justify your fear? Is your fear our fault – or yours, “Christian”? But any of us is ready to meet you any time and we will soon see if who dwells in you is up to facing Who dwells in and with us. Is that fair enough? Or are you afraid?

(By the way, if you go to the farm site, you will find testimonies of many who will outright disagree with your feelings of us.)

You condemn me with unsubstantiated opinion, saying I am prideful. Perhaps I am. So you are the judge of that, are you? Because I know the Scriptures and speak them, am I therefore “prideful”? You say I am not a guy one can reason with. I am reasoning now. How is that? Are my reasonings unreasonable in asking for substance to back up your opinions? How intelligent are you, “Christian”? I know of many unbelievers who can reason much better than you, though you take upon yourself the Name of the Lord. Do you suppose to have the mind of the Lord? True Christians have His mind, and they can reason, and are willing to reason. I am reasoning with you. Are you afraid or speechless, “Anonymous”? Why?

You say that what I say is junk and that I often repeat it, but you don’t say what it is I say. What is “junk,” Anonymous? To the Pharisees, vipers, what Jesus said was “junk.” Are people simply to take your word for it? Nash does. He doesn’t mind. He knows where we stand and have stood, and he does not like it, so he is more than willing to have us condemned without trial or substance. He does not care. He’ll publish any claptrap, even in the Name of the Lord, just to be seen and heard for his own sake.

So you say my “normal process in Southern Alberta is to sneek into churches, steal their membership directories and then send out letters to the congregation telling them everything that was wrong with the message and other targeted attacks on leadership in the local church.”

Is that my “normal process”? Would you care to list the occasions and frequencies in any given period of time? I can say that such is not my “normal process,” but if it were, and God was sending me to do so, who are you to criticize? Are you right? Do you know what you criticize or what I have said? You don’t say.

But I will submit a letter of one of those rare occasions in which I have done what you say in my “normal process,” a letter nearly eight years old, which I have kept on file. Of those mentioned in the letter or of your church, I recall but one that came to our farm before that letter was written, with whom I had a face-to-face talk, when you were selling us roasted grain. Right?

Is your conduct that of a child of light, “Christian”? Or is this the way accusers or devils operate? No doubt your Jesus would do this, seeing you call yourself Christian, but the One I believe and serve would not do so. Would you argue, with reason, “Anonymous”?

Is it any wonder that you, your pastors and the entire congregation was addressed by the Lord in this letter? By the way, your pastor and his wife prophesied great things over us, seeing visions of us as well that, ironically, foretold truly what we would be doing, under God’s direction and favor. Then when their visions were fulfilled in that we did those things prophesied and envisioned, they and their congregation did not like it.

This reminds me of Balaam who opposed Israel, yet prophesied good things of them by the Spirit of the Lord. I am also reminded of Caiaphas, by whose authority they crucified the Christ, yet who prophesied truly of Him:

“And one of them, Caiaphas, being the high priest of that year, said to them, You do not know anything at all, nor do you consider that it is expedient for us that one man should die for the people, and not that the whole nation perish. And he did not speak this of himself, but being high priest that year, he prophesied that Jesus should die for the nation; and not for that nation only, but also that He should gather together in one the children of God who were scattered abroad” (John 11:49-52 MKJV).

You say, “Victor is quite pathetic...like Satan himself.”

Is Satan “pathetic”? He has you in his grips, does he not, “pat”? How pathetic are you, if he is your lord, being pathetic?

You say, “Victors God is what he wants to make him to be so that he can continue on to fight-fight-fight for his god.”

What does this mean? Does anyone know? Are we not accused of strife for evil’s sake? But we are what we are, not because of what we have made of God, as you evilly surmise, but because of what He has made of us. We are here doing, as Jude directed by the Spirit, that which is incumbent on us in the Lord to do:

“Having made all haste to write to you about the common salvation, beloved, I had need to write to you to exhort you to contend earnestly for the faith once delivered to the saints” (Jude 1:3 MKJV).

Here is the letter I wrote then, to which I believe our secret “Christian” friend alludes. If it is another, let him say so; better still, let him identify himself, ask of me, and I will gladly produce it myself, if I have it. Fair enough?

Now, Carla Rolfe, Craig Nash, and all those others who take pleasure in false accusation, throwing out gossip and slander against the brethren in the Lord, when your works are exposed for what they are and you are reproved and warned, you all need to repent, though it is not likely expected any time soon. Still, we know that He chooses the person, time and place. It is only for us to speak the Truth for His sake…and yours.

One day, you will all know your wrong and come to us with shamed faces, because the Lord promised it would be so. We love you because He loves you, and we bless you, though you curse us, in Jesus’ Name.

Rejoicing not in slander and hypocrisy, but in the Truth, by His grace,

Victor Hafichuk

Here you can read the Letter to the New Life Church in Taber, Alberta.

Posting by Jen:

“We love you because He loves you, and we bless you, though you curse us, in Jesus’ Name.”

I wonder, Victor, were you even able to type that line with a straight face?
jen elslager | Homepage | 03.31.08 - 12:31 am | #

Victor’s reply to Jen:

Very straight, in all sincerity and truth, knowing you would find fault with that very statement. Do you call me a liar, Jen?

Posting after our postings removed:

To all:

I have opted to delete many of the comments that came along over the last few days. I know you’ll understand, and I just ask that you might remain in prayer for this situation.
Carla | Homepage | 03.31.08 - 9:55 pm | #

Click HERE to read our conversation with Lisa Nunley.